I’m New Here, Episode 3
Guests: Wayne Peterson, Ivy Watson, Karen Diemart
Pam (voice over) Hello and welcome back to I’m New Here, a podcast from the Bulkley Valley. This is Episode three.
Before I begin this episode, I’d like to share with you a common grievance. The combination of timing, technology and luck in 2020.
Back in June, I was working on a project interviewing people in long term care facilities about the effects of isolation on them in their own words. Someone I could not connect with was a man, who a lot of people told me, I should talk to. After a lot of missed calls and tech issues we finally got on the phone with each other. The audio playing behind me right now is likely a familiar sound to you. The type [sound of typing keys], the skype [Skype boop sound], the hang-ups, and then most conversations starting with a discussion of who’s phone sucks more. I apologize for the quality of the call, it’s a little hard to understand parts of the conversation but what isn’t lacking is Wayne’s wit and classic European way of smirking through most stories.
If you listened to Episode two, you got a taste of the audible smirk I’m talking about.
[Phone ringing]
He reminds me of my grandmothers this way…it was a treat to talk to him.
Wayne: Hello.
Pam: Hi, Wayne…
Wayne: Yeah...they cut me off...they’re coming out to fix my phone but … ?
Pam: OK...yeah, cause I tried calling a few times there but it cancelled the call on me.
But we’re working’ now...so...we’re...we’re good to go...
Wayne: OK…
Pam (voice over) Wayne moved to the Bulkley Valley from Denmark...site unseen at a time when young men were looking for work, a new way of life, or in Wayne’s case, as a way to shirk his inevitable matrimonial state.
Wayne: Yes, I came from Denmark but I wasn’t that old, I was twenty one in Denmark then I came to Smithers. The only way I could come was to work for agriculture. So I was very lucky, had some good times in Canada, that’s for sure.
Pam: Uh...hmm...and so did he sponsor you to come to Canada?
Wayne: No...I was running away from all the women...they all want to get married and I wasn’t ready to get married. Believe it or not, I found my wife in Kitimat.
Pam: So you did...so you got caught…
Wayne: (laughs) yeah…
Pam (voice over) He lives at Skeena Place now. And, at ninety four, is quite active and social or as social as he can be in his long term care home. His only complaint about living in Skeena Place is that they feed the residents too often. He said he doesn’t understand why they feed everyone with only 5 hours in between meals...spoken like a hard working farmer who lived through World War II. When he moved here in 1948, he began working as a logger in The Nass and eventually began working on a farm later owning and operating two farms...one in Terrace and one in Hazleton.
Wayne: Well, I didn’t have much money then but I did well in this country. I had a camp...I had forty five men in camp and I had Hyder four, five guys from Hyder and four or five guys from Kitimat. I was logging, yeah, and I was so far from Terrace. This is a beautiful place, Hazleton. Probably one of the most beautiful places in the world. The mountains there is unbelievable (sic).
Pam: Yeah…
Wayne: People keep coming back...even the Germans come back...that is funny...and I had a lovely wife. I met my wife in Kitimat.
Pam: Tell me about how you met your wife and what your first impressions were.
Wayne: Well...I went to Kitimat and I decided to stay for five years. And I saw the thing being built house by house, road by road. It was very interesting.
Pam: He met his wife in Kitimat playing badminton and they fell in love quickly, and even quicker, started a family.
Pam: What was your wife’s name?
Wayne: Elizabeth.
Pam: Elizabeth…
Wayne: Same as the Queen...born the same week as the Queen…
Pam: Oh!
Wayne: And so was I...and so was I...
Pam (voice over) I need to paraphrase the story of how Wayne and Elizabeth met. This part I would much rather you hear from Wayne himself but the phone call is just not clear enough.
I asked specifics of how they met and this is what he said…
Pam (voice over Wayne’s audio) Well, I was playing badminton...and she walked out onto the court...and she said she’s been talking to some friends and she liked what she heard. She said, “I think I’ll marry you.” I didn’t propose to her...she proposed to me. So I said, “I’d think about it...but thanks for the offer.” But...I married her. She was a lovely woman.
Pam (voice over) Together they had three sons. Both Elizabeth and Wayne were fourteen when World War two started. Wayne said that he had stories to tell me from the war and this is one of them…
Wayne: Oh, yeah...I can tell you all stories about the war too...we were sitting having lunch on the farm and we heard the machine gun go off and we ran outside and there...the British plane had shot down a German plane...the German plane was down on the ground burning...the pilot burned to death...they couldn’t get close to the plane. And three guys jumped out...the first guy made it...he was the only one alive of the three...the other one was hanging in the tree...the other one with his head in the ground...they were dead. The first guy that jumped was alive. Then somebody gave him a cigarette...and he was pretty shaky...
Pam (voice over) Someone get the guy who lived a cigarette...OOOOOHHHH!!! This is so badass and old-school!
Wayne: Then the Germans come picked up the plane and bodies... Well it doesn’t matter what country they’re from. You’ve got to bury them, regardless. It’s unbelievable what happens in the war…
Pam: What’s the secret for living this long? You’re ninety three?
Wayne: Ninety four.
Pam: Ninety four. What’s the secret for living that long?
Wayne: Yeah...I was not...that I’ve been here for two years now…
Pam: Uh hmmm…
Wayne: Well...I don’t know...life is not as long as you think…
Pam: No? Went by fast?
Wayne: I mean life goes pretty quick...and we all went through the war...my wife she went through the war...she was fourteen years old and I was the same age...we were both fourteen when the war started…
Pam: Wow…
Wayne: I should write a book, eh?
Pam: Well, get started! Well, we’ve got, uh, we’ve got the title...I think it should be called “Life Is Not As Long As You Think” (chuckles)
Wayne: Well, that is the right title…
Pam: Yeah…(laughs)...
Wayne: Well, it is...it’s for sure…
Pam (voice over) Speaking of writing a book, back to Ivy Watson from Episode 1...a writer, a thinker, a nerd and, all around, renaissance woman.
Ivy: ...it was a little bit of both...yeah…(laughs)...un, I, like I said, I was sooper lucky in that not only...I lived in a small town...so I...there was...there was limitations there certainly. But I think that just made me, like, more curious because I got a taste of what it, like, what it was like outside and I got a taste, like, of what is available other places through the opportunities that I had because, you know, some dedicated, like, teachers that I had were so fantastic about what they did, um, like ah Heather Leagh and Han Saifco from the, um, from the high school who run like such an incredible theatre program there that is just like out of this world and you have so many, like, young people coming out of that high school with a love of theatre because they treat it with such, like, with such like, um, care, professionalism, um, and so they...they...they create people that love it, um, because they treat it that way.
When I was sixteen, like, hah hah ...when I was sixteen...the...the perception of, uh, forward thinking, open minded community is not invalid...it’s not wrong...those people are here, um, but for places of so few people there is a surprising amount of, um, of group think...um, and...and, like, the, um, ah, gay-straight alliance whatever was, like, hanging on by threads, you know, um, people wouldn’t join because they were scared of, ah, social ostracization, like you just couldn’t do it. I was telling you about this...the drag show that happened a few years ago, um, they couldn’t advertise the show because they’d genuinely feared if they did it would be protested, um, and they’re probably right...ah... the fact that we tried to...we tried to paint a rainbow sidewalk and, not three, four years later, not only can we mysteriously not find the funding to continue it but, even when it was there, we dealt with so many issues of, like, vandalism, people burning out their trucks and the fuckin’ (laughs) ...it’s my own bias coming in...it might not always been trucks (laughs) but (laughs)...it was probably trucks...um...we had...we had...people had suggestions like putting up, um, like comment boxes around it so people could, like, could like, ah...like, God...could put, you know, express their opinions about what they thought...so it was, like, a compromise, um, a compromise for standing up for people’s rights, like the only...literally, the only way that its...gets any better… which it has gotten better, like, we’ve had a, um, Pride committee that’s been put together by Perry Rath, who is a saint of this community, um, and so he’s...he’s put that together in the last few years, and so, yeah...we’ve had our first Black Lives Matter march this summer, um, those are positive steps, um, but it doesn’t...it doesn’t erase what else is going on here, um, but, that’s nothing is...nothing is, um, without, you know, more people moving and getting those issues out in the open and, like, literally everywhere in the world...right? Yeah...
Pam (voice over) When Ivy and I met and subsequently hit it off, she reminded me of my friends who moved away from Strathroy and how noticeable of a change happened to them once they left their small town or their past self. I wanted Ivy’s opinions on local folklore and Smithers’ specific quirks.
Ivy: I feel like all you really have to do, well really like, you know, you don’t have to do anything, but if you want that feeling all you have to do is like walk down like Highway sixteen at like three thirty in the morning and, ah, you will immediately feel...go to the...go to the fucking railway, like, in the middle of the night and you’ll immediately feel, like, and not, like, heh, a murder has DEFINITELY just taken place, like, there’s absolutely No Chance that anyone’s, like, getting home safe, laughs, um, and it’s like the um eerie-ness that comes from a small town is Not lost on Smithers. Absolutely not. Um...like that’s how...that’s how I…(laughs) I love mountains because I just feel like, all the time, there’s just like...oh, my God, I still haven’t been to the peak, like it’s shameful for me to admit I grew up here and I still haven’t been to the top...but I will, I will, I will... One day when it doesn’t feel like...or one summer when it doesn’t feel like actual winter every day. Oh, God...oh that’s right, (laughs), yeah, every new...every new person that comes to Smithers is always like “That fuckin’ noon air horn!” and I’m like “Oh, yeah...right!”. I forget that happens...I was just so, like, so part of, like, Smithers now. They keep doing that and it’s amazing to me that still happens...yeah…
Pam (voice over) So, while she was home, was she happy to be back?
Ivy: I am, yeah, hiding from the pandemic currently...I hiked like a fiend! I hiked like a fiend for the first, like, 3...2 weeks...um, I had just spent, like 2 months holed up in my tiny apartment in Toronto so I was, like, just ready to breathe air and stretch my legs and that was part of why I came back here. Um, but, ah, no, I...I mean I...I don’t need a ton of, hah, social, um...interaction to be having...but, ah...no, I don’t...I don’t feel lonely, um...usually coming back to Smithers is like something to look forward to, um, as long as it’s just for a visit...um, that’s all you need to feel about it...to wanna be back here...it’s easy to feel settled here. And that that’s the feeling that you’re looking for...then...than perfect! Um...and that’s a super, super valid reason...I would say that there is nothing wrong with that. I can totally see, like, I can see that scenario happening for myself like later on and also because, you know, knowing people that live in the valley who have more than just their own family here, like people who have, like, aunts, uncles, grandparents...like, if those people can live in the same community, um...and, and, and make it theirs, like make it their...their life, like, um, integrated in that way, then that’s a super attractive, uh...lifestyle, like, for a lot of people and I think that’s really fair and particularly now that Smithers is growing, um, at a rate that seems to have accelerated as of recently, um, that’s only going to become more easier and easier because it’s gonna be available for more people to do more things. You know...maybe, like, when I was growing up there was only a handful of careers...opportunities in Smithers whereas now more different kinds of people can move here because its seems like a bunch of different industries are growing including what we’re talking about in the arts and kind of more creative industries, so, um, I am, uh, supportive of that. (laughs) I like seeing that. I do...genuinely.
Pam (voice over) I’m happy to be new here. And I feel like I might have landed here at the exact...right...moment. Six weeks after the day I moved here, we were put into our first lockdown. And the rest of the world was freaked out, bugged out, locked in, shut down...but, here in Smithers, once the dust settled, life got back to normal...sort of...and our paradise felt even more, er, ‘paradiser’?
Ivy: Um...Just have to, like, walk down main street and see all the cool, new places that are opening up and...It’s becoming a personal town and see how much we love the brewery...Love the breweries...shout out to the brewery forever...yeah (laughs)...both of them (laughs) the one and then the other one (laughs)...you work out which ones I’m talking about…
Pam: What are you going to miss if you move back to Toronto? Cause you’re leaving in about ten days...
Ivy: That motherfucker, right there...sorry...for swearing...that motherfucker right there...I’m pointing to the mountain...yeah...um...my peripheral vision likes it’s hugs...and it’s sad when, um, when they’re gone...but, uh...no...I will...I miss...I miss...I do miss Smithers when I’m gone...but I miss it in the way that, like, you miss your parents (laughs)...you know...you miss them...and then your back and then your like...OK...I need another break, now (laughs)
Pam: Laundry is always on the same floor?
Ivy: (laughs) yeah...that’s true...I mean it usually doesn’t cost anything...the audacity!
Pam: Your mom is happy to have you guys at home, too...
Ivy: Yes! Yeah...she, uh... I’m, uh, I, um, ah sharing a room with my sister...that’ll be nice, as well. Yeah...we’re literally sharing a room, yeah...my mom downsized to a condo so...
Pam: Yeah...Do you guys have a lot of tape down the middle...like this is my side of the room... that is yours?
Ivy: How else are we gonna keep things organized?
Pam: OK...Ivy...Thank You !
Ivy: (laughs) Thank you...
Pam (voice over) Speaking of missing things... Karen Diemart from Episode one has left Smithers. After a marathon run as a Smithereen and pivotal personality in the Environmental Science and Music Community, Karen and her husband, Bruce, moved to Powell River after our interview. Ah...I feel like I worded that weird...she didn’t move to Powell River because of our interview, by the way, but, curiously enough, it was just shortly after I moved to Smithers that they decided to go.
Karen and I talked about how it was going to feel to extract herself and her roots from Smithers...and what she was sentimental about. I feel like I was ‘fishing’ for good tape, getting Karen to talk about her past and what she’ll hold dear once she’s not here anymore.
Pam: Is there a message, and this might be too personal, but is there a message that you would like to leave the people of Smithers? Your friends...your...you know...the community that you obviously had such a huge part in building...do you have a message for them that you’d like to leave before you...I mean not that you’re going to disappear off the face of the earth, but...
Karen: No…
Pam: You know...you have a lovely house here that you have been so integral to the community, um, is there a message that you’d leave them?
Karen: Hum... I have total faith that they will continue and, um, I just hope that that’s the way that it goes...um, I can’t see it being anything other than...you know...I’m totally replaceable and, you know, I hope that people will come and visit…
Pam: Yeah…
Karen: And, for sure...we’ll be back…
Pam: Yeah…
Karen: You know...we’ll come back for the festival…
Pam: Absolutely…I mean you will be missed! Right….I mean when we...when I got in...started to get involved with mid-summer and working with the crew here...I mean...you’re such a kinda stalwart presence on the board and people relying on you and managing, um, the kitchen and all the other aspects that people you have were people that just turn to you and want your, um, want your opinion on things, I think that that will be something that will be missed especially in next year that we have...when we have mid-summer...
Karen: Hm...hm...well I’ve hope that people listen and they can take from all of that and continue to make it cause there...there’s lots of people who have the same luck that I do and they can do it…
Pam: Yeah…
Karen: I KNOW they can do it! Um...and my motto’s always been Well, Just Do It! So...you know...you can...go for it!
I was twenty four...I came here...had family. It’s a great place to raise your kids...it’s wonderful...and your kids either decide they like it too or they don’t...so some of them go...some of them stay...some of the ALL go and some of them drift back...Now there’s lots of young people coming in who are in their mid-twenties early thirties, they're having their kids so that kind of actual sort of family thing, I think, is still happening because this IS a great place to raise your kids. Smithers is easy service...is easy getting around...has beautiful outdoors if you like to be outside, this is the place for you. None of that’s changed. Um...the people that I first met when I came here...some of those people are still my friends…
Pam: Yeah.
Karen: You know...like it’s a...it’s a long time...it’s a big piece of...ah...my life that I’ve been here.
Pam: Mh hmmm.
Karen: And those people...you know...we grew together...they were young just like I was...and we all grew together doing many things for the community. There’s a lot of stuff that happens in Smithers...there’s lots of activities...lots of things to keep you busy here...it's’ a beautiful, um, geographic location...there are a lot of outdoor activities, you know, there’s no being bored here.
Pam: Yeah, yeah…
Karen: If you’re bored, I don’t understand you...because there’s so much to keep you going. One thing I did notice is people...when they come here...they put in four years and if they make four years...they’re lifers…
Pam: Mh hmmm.
Karen: But a lot leave at four.
Pam: Put in four years...in this community, you mean…
Karen: In living here…
Pam: OK
Karen: Doing whatever they’re doing…
Pam: Right
Karen: But, I’ve known a lot of people that have come here and after four years...they’re gone...because they couldn’t find their niche...they just couldn’t...they don’t know where it is…
Pam: Yeah…
Karen: And I don’t know if it’s because there’s too much or there’s not enough for them to be able to understand.
Pam (voice over) I kept this part of our conversation to the end of the show because she’s known as being kind of threatening...Her legacy of work in the decades she worked at the Ministry of Forest Lands and Natural Resource Operations has made her a figure on incredible intelligence, managerial prowess and an inalterable value driven person. But when we were just sitting in her half-packed kitchen, surrounded by Bruce’s carvings and woodwork, and looking out onto her enormous garden, she didn't have her guard up...she wasn’t trying to protect an image I might have cast on her...she just talked about the place that shaped her and why she was gonna miss it.
Karen: The, um, the ease of this place is a big one….
Pam: Yeah…
Karen: When you think about going someplace else, I mean that’s a thing about Powell River that’s attractive...it’s...it’s not a big, congested place...cause I couldn’t live in a big congested place…
Pam: Yeah…
Karen: And it’s, while it’s at the top end of the Sunshine Coast, and it’s a...it’s a new chapter..it’s a...Bruce calls it a new project and...and there’s lots of exciting things there...focus on that, and, I mean, your going to have the ocean...I love the ocean...you know...there’s things that...that it does spiritually to me that the mountains will do...with the ground… yeah... my grounding is the earth...always has been...and...and, ah, growing up in Toronto, we had a farm in Niagara Peninsula and I loved going there and my Dad always said that he took my Mom from the farm and drug her to the city where her first love was in the farm and I think there’s a fair amount of that in me that I don’t like the hustle and bustle of the city.
Pam: Yeah…
Karen: And... care...care about the...my environment and the...and what it is...and I always wanted to go into the sciences...my Dad thought I was crazy, you know...at that time…
Pam: Knowing the sciences like what you did?
Karen: Ah...no...ah...my sons are both in science careers but…
Pam: But...you were the first one…
Karen: Uh...yeah...and, um, he thought I was nuts, oh, you know...he said “oh you should be taking typing and you could be a secretary”...and I just look at him and go “really?” ...like...I learned how to type when it was time to do my thesis because you had to type it and I didn’t want to pay somebody...I didn’t have any money to pay somebody so that is when I learned how to type and promptly dropped it (laughs)...
Pam: Was your family, um... were they supportive of the move?
Karen: To here?
Pam: Yeah…Well, I guess to Victoria first, right? And then...to move out west...
Karen: Well...you know...for sure ah but I now, being an older person with children who have gone very far away...I know what I did to them...I know the feeling and its kinda weird but that’s what we did...you know... I moved across the country...I have one son that moved half way around the world and, now with COVID, we don’t know when we will even see each other again, right?
Pam: Well...how’s the packing going?
Karen: Ah...well...as you can see...there’s boxes there (laughs) everywhere...lol...we still have a bit of time so...
Pam: Yeah…
Karen: I can’t do this all day long ...so…I tend to do stuff in the morning and then get outside in the afternoon...
Pam: Yeah…
Karen: Yeah…
Pam: Yeah…um...is this sentimental for you?
Karen: It’s huge...yeah…
Pam: But it’s magical...this place is magical though...I mean there’s a reason why…
Karen: Well, this house is full of Bruce...you know, I said to him the other day, like with Owen leaving on Wednesday, uh, and the feelings that you have over all of that even though we're going to be really close and nothings saying he’s even going to stay in Victoria, um, I said I think you know if anything happened to you and you, you left before me, um, I don’t think I could stay here because so much of...like this whole house...you know...everything...anything thats wood is Bruce…
Pam: Yeah…
Karen: And, um, and he looked at it in a different way and he said “Yeah, but, you could also say...aww...that was my dear husband…” (laughs)
Pam: (laughs) yeah….he’s the sentimental one, right?
Karen: Pretty much…
Pam: Yeah…
Karen: But...yup...so...it’s an emotional thing but you know you get through it...you look at the...like I said... look at the other and because it’s so different and it’s made it real clear to me that it’s a good place to go...
Pam (voice over) That’s it for Episode 3 of I’m New Here. Thanks to Wayne and Skeena Place for ensuring our call even happened...for a while there, it felt like we were never going to talk...Also thanks to Ivy, who’s back in Toronto, and who I’m very excited to see once this pandemic is over. Ooh, still have to watch The Weekend her favourite movie.
Shout out to Karen, we at the the Midsummer Festival miss her and Bruce A LOT. You really, really meant something to this town.
The music in this episode was by Makaih Beats and stay tuned for one last episode of I’m New Here…
Thanks for listening.